Karen M. Drabenstott
Associate Professor
School of Information
University of Michigan
Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1092 USA
Voice: (734) 763-3581
Fax: (734) 764-2475
karen.drabenstott@umich.edu
New topic -- "Open Discussion"
We have come to the end of our scheduled list of discussion topics. Many thanks to Jim Shedlock for leading our discussion on "Education for Deinstitutionalizing the Profession."
We are now beginning an open topics discussion. We will have such a discussion for as long as it takes to:
I have thought about termination because of the low message traffic on several recent topics including our most recent one. Despite Jim Shedlock's best efforts, including a terrific introduction, message traffic on our last topic was especially slow. In fact, messages were so few that our guest editor suggested the following:
I challenge our membership to begin a dialogue that leads to one or more of the following:
Let the dialogue begin!
Anne K. Abate
Doctoral Candidate
Nova Southeastern University
Fort Lauderdale, Florida
abate@scis.nova.edu
Stop CRISTAL!?! No way! I think this is a great list. Although I have only served one term as a guest editor, this experience did quite a bit to advance my own understanding of the questions under discussion. I also enjoy viewing and partaking in the academic debate. And it's so much cheaper than a conference.
My own excuse is a heavier than usual work and school schedule. I was really looking forward to enjoying this list in earnest following my graduation this summer. There must be more we all want to discuss. Perhaps people have migrated to other lists? What are those other lists?
I know several of the list members personally. I challenge you to come forward to help figure out why we aren't generating more discussion here. Perhaps some are frightened away by the highly academic quality of the debate?
Education is crucial to our future as a profession. We must debate and discuss how are future leaders will be educated. This has been a really great start, but I think we can do so much more. Especially on the international level we have been able to reach.
Anyone else?
Peter G. Underwood
Pmail (local): education/pgu
Director
School of Librarianship
University of Cape Town
Republic of South Africa
Voice: (national): (021) 650 3090
Private Bag (international): + 27 21 650 3090
Rondebosch 7700 Fax: (national): (021) 650 3489
Cape Town: (international): + 27 21 650 3489
pgu@education.uct.ac.za
I'm in favour of the list continuing because the quality, rather than quantity, of contributions and responses has often been indicative of real needs. I've not been an active respondent for some time, mostly because of pressure of work, but I have read all the 'traffic' and have often found some stimulating ideas developing.
What may be helpful at this stage is to review one of the topics which created a lot of traffic in the early days of the list, especially one where feelings and opinions have moved on a bit.
By way of encouraging this, why not publish a table showing topic and traffic?
Lee Liming
Webmaster
lliming@tir.com
I've been a "lurker" on the CRISTAL-ED list since its first posting. It's one of only two lists I keep myself subscribed to, and I've found professional value in it as I continue to work in the information industry. I've never been on the staff of a library, nor do I expect to be. However, I have a healthy respect for the value and relevance of the theory and techniques that are taught in "library schools" and their subsequent incarnations. I'll be blunt: my interest isn't the future of libraries, but the future of the values and intellectual foundations that libraries and library schools have built, which I believe must now be carried into the new information-intensive professions and industries that we're creating.
I'd like to propose an inversion of recent lines of thinking here, and a return to some of the ideas that were just beginning to be discussed when this forum was created in 1995.
Rather than focusing on what's wrong with the profession and professional education -- rather than agonizing over how to preserve libraries and library education with increasingly limited resources -- why not try to envision how the current professional values and foundations can be applied to new fields? Why not consider how the foundations of information management apply to the broader information industry, and how that could lead to marshaling the industry's vitality toward preserving the continuing education of information professionals, both for libraries and for new ventures? I propose that a discussion of the latter issues will inevitably clarify the former, and that tackling it in the opposite direction may provide a more productive context in which to address the issue of change.
I've seen ample evidence in my professional work (and I'm sure I'm not alone in this!) that the theory and techniques taught in "library schools" and their successors are vital to the success of information-related ventures, whether they're service-oriented or part of the booming information and media industries. Technology alone does not create solutions. (Duh! Right?) Creating quality information products and services requires the involvement of "knowledge workers," who understand the intermingling of information organization, management, and access. Who are these people today? I'll bet some of you are saying to yourselves, "Hey, that's me!" Let's hear from you. How are you using your "library" education to create new, innovative, non-traditional information products and services?
Here are just a few related topics for discussion.
And for those who insist on turning it back to libraries...
Keith V. Trickey
Liverpool Business School
k.v.trickey@livjm.ac.uk
As a long time lurker, and a sometime -- if indeed brief contributor -- I was reminded of a story of an idea that might once have been a story. It was about a navigation beacon, that was sat out in the ocean regularly sending out its patterned beams of light for all the world to see. Now the beacon did not get to see many people because they simply used its light to navigate by -- in fact they were oblivious of the vital impact the beacon had on their safe passage on an uncertain ocean. Because the beacon was not being recognized for its useful work a committee decided to turn the beacon off... I guess you can work out what happened next...
I don't always read CRISTAL-ED, I don't always reply to CRISTAL-ED but I do know it works away very gently shifting my thinking about the whole area of the academic future of our discipline. I would sadly miss the aid to navigation it provides and my sense of being part of a much larger network than the limits of the UK.
Keep on keepin' on.
Bethany V. Thompson
University of Kentucky
Full-fledged Librarian and School Media Specialist
bvthomi@lex.infi.net
After a six month hiatus, I recently resubscribed to CRISTAL-ED for several reasons. The first is that I took my comprehensive exams on April 11th and knew that the electronic discussion group would definitely offer me thoughts to ponder (as well as share with fellow comps takers) in preparation for the exam. Not only did this prove to be effective, but I also encouraged other students in the program to subscribe as this is an excellent source for topical discussions that are not just theory.
A second reason, is that I missed an opportunity to sound out my own ideas or theories on the issues discussed and was delighted that people responded to what I had to say -- pro or con.
The third reason for resubscribing is that I finished my last course for my master's degree on Monday evening and will miss the interaction with my fellow students and the professors as well. What better way to stay mentally challenged and current than to become involved with this ongoing discussion?
Please, all of you out there who read, but don't necessarily respond, speak up. Yes, reading the literature is fine, but to be able to interact is a much better way to stay in touch with the issues and far more personal. I agree with Peter Underwood that quality is better than quantity and that perhaps revisiting topics that got a lot of responses might be the best place to start.
Thank you for my two minutes and please, let's find a way to continue CRISTAL-ED.
Kathleen Koontz
kckoon@juno.com
I think Anne Abate may be on to something when she wrote, "Perhaps some are frightened away by the highly academic quality of the debate?" Several of the self-proclaimed "lurkers" mentioned they were reluctant to respond because they fear their opinions might be wrong. While most of us worry about saying something that will cause our colleagues to think less of us, the purpose of this list is to exchange ideas through discussion, not to determine the "one correct" solution or opinion. Having been a lurker for almost a year before I sent my first "posting," I understand how intimidating it is to join in a professional conversation with professors such of William Lieb who seem to have a thoughtful response for every topic. However, a discussion cannot exist without participants and even those of us who are new to the profession have unique insights and opinions to contribute.
CRISTAL-ED is a wonderful way for us to communicate on a regular basis with fellow members of our profession whom we may never have had the chance to meet outside this forum. Hopefully, others who feel the same way will be willing to participate and we will be able to enjoy CRISTAL-ED for years to come.
Getting off my soapbox.
Ray E. Metz
University Library
Case Western Reserve University
11055 Euclid Ave.
Cleveland, OH 44106
Voice: (216) 368-2992
Fax: (216) 368-6950
rem4@po.cwru.edu
In the words of Sally Field, "You like me. You really, really like me!"
OK, "We like CRISTAL-ED. We really, really like it!"
Perhaps it's time for some of us who have been quiet to volunteer to help. Volunteer? What a concept... Maybe we could get some of our political leaders to consider such an option...
I suggest that if you are willing to help, let Karen know. Sometimes it's got to feel like a burden. But I bet most of us see it as a tremendous opportunity to "listen in" on important subjects. Am I right?
Beth Thompson
Sayre School Library
Lexington, KY
bvthomi@lex.infi.net
Just a thought I feel compelled to add -- I was fortunate enough to have as my first course toward an LIS master's, Information in Society, with Dr. Michael Harris (author of Into the Future). We spent a great deal of time reading and discussing this very debate of how to carry the profession forward without discrediting those currently working. Although we never reached the perfect answer, I personally felt and continue to feel that we need to be cautious about throwing the old out entirely in favor of the new.
Cataloging may seem to be for our profession a dying field, but I have to believe that taking cataloging helped me to understand a great deal about the way we order the materials that we offer in our libraries (be they online or in a physical building). Even though we may not become catalogers, we still need to understand the process or else how will we know if the information we retrieve is what we want.
As an online student cataloger, I found many mistakes in OCLC records, without an understanding of the process, I would have assumed that those records were correct. Somehow this seems foreign to my philosophy of life not to mention my profession. Do we really have to do a complete turn around just to maintain our professionalism? Isn't there some common ground with both and shouldn't we look for that commonality? I came to this profession at the age of 44 having survived the '60s philosophy of throw it out and start over and don't want to go there again.
Karen M. Drabenstott
Associate Professor
School of Information
University of Michigan
Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1092 USA
Voice: (734) 763-3581
Fax: (734) 764-2475
karen.drabenstott@umich.edu
Yes, we hear the groundswell of support for continuing the CRISTAL-ED LISTSERV! Without a doubt, the CRISTAL-ED LISTSERV will CONTINUE.
To ensure a healthy, informative, useful listserv discussion, we NEED guest editors to come forward and volunteer to lead discussions. Leading a discussion is not a complex, scary, all-time-and mind-consuming task. That's all it takes is an informative introduction to get the discussion started. Then monitor the discussion during the one- or two-week discussion, comment on ideas, summarize to refresh the discussion, or, sometimes, be provocative to stimulate the membership to respond.
Please don't be turned away by thoughts that you are not qualified to lead a discussion. Students enrolled in masters or doctoral programs, recent graduates of various professional programs, and individuals who just have an interest in our discussions (people without professional degrees) have served admirably as guest editors.
Do not concern yourself with "flames" from CRISTAL-ED members. Steve Wooldridge, our technical moderator, reviews all postings before compiling the digest. Most questionable messages he deletes are those redundant "unsubscribe," "subscribe," and "on vacation" messages that fill all our message coffers. When Steve encounters a message that has the potential to inflame members, he confers with me and/or our guest editor and we discuss posting the message in question. Sometimes we confer with the author of the message, discuss the situation, and resolve it in a way that is satisfactory to everyone involved. This situation RARELY occurs (less than half dozen times a year?). Generally CRISTAL-ED is a polite, gentle, academic conversation and I aim to keep it that way.
To keep this message at a reasonable length, I will put a list of topics that CRISTAL-ED members have suggested to date in a separate message. In the meantime, please consider my invitation to lead a CRISTAL-ED discussion. If you want talk to me or Steve directly, message us at karen.drabenstott@umich.edu and swooldri@umich.edu, respectively, and we will reply in good time.
Again, thanks for all support. We are heartened by your loyalty and dedication to CRISTAL-ED. Let's keep up the good work with topic suggestions and guest editor volunteers rolling in by the dozens!
Karen M. Drabenstott
Associate Professor
School of Information
University of Michigan
Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1092 USA
Voice: (734) 763-3581
Fax: (734) 764-2475
karen.drabenstott@umich.edu
As promised, here is a list of topics that CRISTAL-ED members have suggested over the last few days. Please review this list and message me directly regarding your interest in leading a discussion on a listed topic. Or, send your comments regarding these and other topics you have in mind to the CRISTAL-ED LISTSERV directly so that we, as a group, can rework these topics into something better that will really fly in a super discussion. The list follows:
Whew! Over a dozen topics suggested so far. Now, if these don't turn you on, think about articles that you've been intending or thinking about writing. Use CRISTAL-ED as an opportunity to churn, marinade, develop, clarify your ideas. Or, if you are wrestling with some idea, operation, situation at work, bring your troubles to CRISTAL-ED and we can resolve or muddy the waters more for you here.
Please, do consider my invitation to serve as a CRISTAL-ED guest editor. I've even reviewed resumes which list CRISTAL-ED editorship in the "service" sections of their resumes. This is an opportunity to serve your profession and help us all learn and grow in the process.
Luz Quiroga
lquiroga@indiana.edu
I am one of those guilty lurkers. In my case, the reason is not of lack of time but (I have to accept it) that the quality of the "editors" gave me confusing feelings: I was amazed of "listening" and "almost" conversing with the best professors in our field, but at the same time I got panic of looking silly in front of this type of audience.
Anyway, we will not get anything just with expressing our solidarity and gratefulness to Karen Drabenstott and her guest editors. It seems that a change is needed, hopefully one that does not include closing the list. Maybe we can focus on trying to identify changes that could help.
Just an idea: if many of us have the fear I have, a change in the logistic could help:
For example, the responsibility of being "editor" could be given to a small group, two or three persons, with different levels of expertise: n student, a practitioner, a lecturer; or the "editor" could be the student chapter of a certain school; or the editor could be a master's or doctoral student presenting their research ideas, etc., etc. ... I can imagine several scenarios that are less scaring but my English is not good enough to express them .... I am sure that you have other ideas to make this more amicable without big sacrifices in quality ... Let us know them ...
Karen M. Drabenstott
Associate Professor
School of Information
University of Michigan
Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1092 USA
Voice: (734) 763-3581
Fax: (734) 764-2475
karen.drabenstott@umich.edu
Luz Quiroga's suggestion ...
"for example, the responsibility of being 'editor' could be given to a small group, two or three persons, with different levels of expertise: an student, a practitioner, a lecturer; or the 'editor' could be the student chapter of a certain school; or the editor could be a master's or doctoral student presenting their research ideas, etc."
... is an excellent one. We had co-editors, Margaret Hedstrom and Beth Yakel, serve last year for an active discussion on archives. Margaret is on our faculty and Beth is finishing her doctorate here at Michigan. Since then, a few prospective guest editors have contacted me regarding their interest in doing a co-editorship but they have reported that it has been difficult for them to do this electronically with someone who was not at the same geographical location.
Please don't let their unsuccessful efforts hold you back! If a pack of doctoral students, practitioners, or faculty wants to combine their efforts in orchestrating a discussion, this would be a fine change of pace. You know how to reach me (karen.drabenstott@umich.edu) and you have a long list of topics I posted on Thursday from which to select. You can also suggest topics you have in mind or are studying in connection with exams, writing a paper, doing a research project, and so on.
Tahirih Mitchell
U.S. Geological Survey Library
TMitchell@isdmnl.wr.usgs.gov
I don't know if this is on the list of proposed topics but here goes:
The Impact of Contracting Out on Library Services.
I currently work in a federal library in the Washington, D.C., area and most government facilities are turning to contractors. There is much consternation in the ranks that this has had a negative effect on library services. Perhaps this is true in non-federal facilities too -- I don't know since I'm only familiar with activities in the federal sector.
Bradley Leland Taylor
bltaylor@umich.edu
Connections 97
The Third Great Lakes Information Science Conference
A doctoral student conference hosted by the University of Michigan School of Information will be held in Ann Arbor, Michigan on October 24-25, 1997. The conference will provide a forum for the exchange of research among doctoral students from all information science related fields. In addition to student presentations, two invited speakers will address the attendees and several social events are planned to increase networking opportunities. Possible topics include, but are not limited to:
A call for abstracts and detailed information about conference arrangements will be issued later this spring. If you would like to be sure to receive this information, please send a message to either of the addresses given below, and the information will be forwarded to you when it becomes available.
For further information, contact:
Connections 97
School of Information
University of Michigan
304 West Hall
550 East University Avenue
Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1092
Connections97@umich.edu
April Bohannan
Assistant Professor
School of Library and Information Studies
Texas Woman's University
f_bohannan@VENUS.TWU.EDU
"The Impact of Contracting Out on Library Services"
I like this one. More of this kind of thing is moving into the non-federal sector but having worked for a federal contractor, I find the impact on the profession, and professional relationships equally interesting. This is especially true when those working with the contractor are not those who made the decision to contract -- as is usually the case.
Karen M. Drabenstott
Associate Professor
School of Information
University of Michigan
Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1092 USA
Voice: (734) 763-3581
Fax: (734) 764-2475
karen.drabenstott@umich.edu
Since my summary late last week, we seem to have reached a standstill regarding new topics suggestions. Certainly there is a keen interest in "outsourcing" and I am searching for a guest editor to lead such a discussion.
Examples are:
After all my hard work in describing how easy guest editing is, I've had few volunteers come forward. Come on -- volunteer -- live dangerously!
Diane M. Lewis
Serial Records Librarian (also Exchange and Gift Librarian)
U.S. Geological Survey Library
National Center - MS 950
Reston, Virginia 20192
Voice: (703) 648-4399
dilewis@igsrglib01.usgs.gov
This thread is particularly interesting to me as a federal librarian. The shortcuts and cutbacks in service which contractors must often institute invariably affect this equation. Contractors MUST make a profit.
For some services, expediency and streamlining accomplished through contracting out are fine. For others, government regulations and the higher public good make the services so costly that the contractor is forced to provide less than optimum service and the process defeats itself. I can say that it takes wise management in an agency to know when and what to contract out.
Donna Smith
dlsmith@cbus.mindspring.com
"The Impact of Contracting Out on Library Services"
I also like this one -- I am a civilian working on a military post but I am not civil service or military. I am an interested party since I work for an educational institution providing degree programs for the military and am responsible for information and library services for the students but don't have a library to "call my own."
John Buschman
Collection Development Librarian
Rider University
2083 Lawrenceville Road
Lawrenceville, NJ 08648
buschman@genius.rider.edu
DO LIBRARIANS HAVE INTELLECTUAL FREEDOM IN THEIR WORKPLACE?: A QUESTIONNAIRE (brief)
Introduction
Perhaps a lesser known aspect of librarianship's defense of intellectual freedom is the connection to the right of librarians to intellectual freedom in their professional work and workplace. There are, in fact, numerous ALA and other policy statements covering this over 50 years. For instance, in 1946 the ALA endorsed and adapted the standard policy on academic freedom for college professors to librarians: "Academic freedom means for the librarian intellectual freedom [which] implies freedom in the selection of books, in the presentation of material on all sides of controversial questions, and in the dissemination of information on all subjects. [This] makes it possible for librarians to devote themselves to the practice of their profession without fear of interference or of dismissal for ... unjust reasons." (ALA Bulletin, June 1946) Further, current policy statements like the "Security of Employment for Library Employees" state that "Security of Employment, as an elementary right, guarantees specifically: ...Intellectual freedom.., Appointments and promotions based solely on merit.., The opportunity for the library employee to work without fear of interference or dismissal ... for unjust reasons." The Standards for Faculty Status for College & University Librarians indicates that librarians "should have the maximum possible latitude in fulfilling [their] responsibilities" and that they should then be judged and promoted "on the basis of their academic proficiency and professional effectiveness." Lastly, the ACRL adopted in 1972 a ringing endorsement of academic freedom for librarians in higher education: "Academic freedom ... is indispensible to librarians, because they are trustees of knowledge with the responsibility of ensuring the availability of information and ideas, no matter how controversial, so that teachers may freely teach and students may freely learn." (Policy Documents & Reports, AAUP 1995)
The brief list of questions which follow are meant to explore the climate of intellectual freedom within the library workplace, for librarians. We very much appreciate your time and help in filling out these questions. Of course, all responses (via e-mail or in paper) will be kept strictly confidential. We apologize to those who happen to receive more than one copy of the questionnaire on separate lists.
Questions
Please indicate your response to the following questions by indicating the appropriate number:
#1 - Strongly agree
#2 - Agree
#3 - No opinion
#4 - Disagree
#5 - Strongly disagree
If you have any comments or an example to relate to questions 7 through 15 about, please write them below:
Thank you again for your help. Please send this form back via E-mail to either John Buschman (Buschman@genius.Rider.edu) or Mark Rosenzweig (Librfmcr@vaxc.hofstra.edu) or print out the questions and write the answers and mail them to:
John Buschman
Collection Development Librarian
Rider University
2083 Lawrenceville Road
Lawrenceville, NJ 08648
Tahirih Mitchell, MLS
U.S. Geological Survey Library
Reston, VA
TMitchell@isdmnl.wr.usgs.gov
A fellow librarian suggested a topic for future discussion so I told him I would pass it along: Ethics of Librarian Job Postings -- many jobs are listed without salaries and some even mention that they are negotiable. It seems this will lead to a general lowering of pay and also makes one suspect that those not listing salary ranges are looking for the "cheapest" employees they can find.
Tahirih Mitchell, MLS
U.S. Geological Survey Library
Reston, VA
TMitchell@isdmnl.wr.usgs.gov
I recently paraphrased a suggested topic given to me by a fellow librarian. I evidently left out some of his key points so here they are:
Re: Ethics in Librarian Job Postings: There are often unreasonable burdens on first round job applicants, i.e., official copies of transcripts at $10-20 a pop times 2+ schools, letters of reference specifically written for each job application, special non-job requirements such as chauffeur's driver's license, etc. Also, another issue is what should a job applicant say about salary requirements since sometimes there is a feeling the employer is only looking for the cheapest candidates. In that case, an applicant shouldn't waste his/her time or that of the employer.
Shirley Richardson
Shirley.Richardson@rampo.angelo.edu
It seems unfair to the applicants not to give at least a minimum-maximum range.
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